The Long-Form Census Flap: Much Ado About Everything That Amounts to Nothing
I am as absolutely delighted that the mandatory long form is being scrapped by the Tories as I am that last year’s swimming trunks either need the attention of my tailor Fernando, or I really have lost a few pounds.
I couldn’t care less about all the left wing whiners (or even the right wing ones) that are so very exorcised over this quiet little initiative by the Harper government–perhaps, playing to its base. It’s a fairly innocuous effort at that.
For the life of me, why are so many clamoring for the pitchforks and lanterns over this issue? Is the sun not bright enough? Are we not basking global warming’s warm bosom? Is our time in July’s last few not better spent buying a Dixie cup of lemonade from the child on the corner or stopping to watch our old timers at the lawn bowling center? Why aren’t you all down at the Billy sharing a glass of ale with a veteran who sacrificed a brother or two so that you didn’t have to?
Nothing better to do?
Honestly, I’m astonished this is such a big deal.
But for those of you who have written me and demanded a thought or three, here they are…
Off the top, any time a govt needs to threaten someone with a penalty to do something of such dubious, under the specious guise of “a better nation”, I think it’s worthwhile at least revisiting what it is that the penalty is for in the first place. Threatening someone to fill out a bloody form is absurd–always has been, always will be. It is, at the very, very least, itself an infraction against one’s right to full and complete individual liberty.
We cannot pretend that it is not.
Additionally, just how much did the long form ever contribute to better policies or initiatives by ANY govt? Do any of the questions asked mean much in terms of how govt spends or, (pretends that it) saves? Of course not. None of the anti-Harper pack that have come out on this issue, through all of their inexorable, nanny-state venom, have provided the Canadian public with a stitch of proof that the long form has made Canada, or Canadians, more efficient. Zilch in this regard, just a great deal of posturing.
To be clear: Census data isn’t what makes the govt of the day more efficient or better equipped to handle the job of managing the country.
Pigeon-holing Canadians isn’t the answer.
Frankly, and to be most specific, the questions asked, for me, have always been quite intrusive. I have no problem telling CCRA how much I earned and how painful it is to hand them almost half every year. But why must I go off and give specifics to another branch of govt? It’s none of their goddamn business, or anyone else’s. Why do you care how I get to work and by which mode of travel? I wouldn’t soon care if anyone arrived by glider, Vespa or horse-drawn carriage.
I don’t want to be involved in another man’s home anymore than I want him involved in mine. And in this day and age of bureaucratic incompetence, and, at times, willful criminality, why would I want ot increase the chances of my identity being heisted (once again!)
You will find the historical questions asked, here.
I, for one, applaud the Harper govt for doing this. It won’t hurt this country at all.
Bad initiatives do. This isn’t one of them.
Pip, Pip, and all that old rot! Good riddance to the bad rubbish that is the Long Form. Not to worry, there are lots out there willing to fill out these long forms for the sake of trying to skew the stats into serious social adjustments by engineering the busy-bodies and bean counters in the Snivel service. Thanks for that Alex, a breath of fresh air, even Tom Flanagan was heard denouncing the Conservative take on this, he must have got a job in the civil service or else it affects his income in some way.
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I am often left wondering what happened to Tom Flanaghan….though, for now, I will keep my opinions to myself.
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Ditto.
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Partially can come to a consensus on the census.
In regards to your question about who the h-e-double hockey sticks
cares about how you get to work and how (car, bus tram, train, bike, Hawg, or horse) it is actually quite important. The data is used by civic governments (if they aren’t already messing up with given away tickets to paid people who think they are volunteers!) to determine transit needs and paths (not pathegens).
That long form data is also used for marketing in business. You’ve seen those books in the library. they have tons of material in there that can if you know how to read ‘em, that can show where to send your stuff and to whom. No, I am not a pencil pouched geek, but have used the information believe it or not in politcs. It can be very useful.
Although some of the questions are a bit much. Such as the one asking what kind of toliet paper a person uses. That was a bit craptacular and a person’s means of abilution and how a person empties their personal holding tank is very personal.
Business use the statistics for marketing purposes (although Scott Paper would be interested in toilet paper usage, but Starbucks would not they would be interested in coffee consumption as would Timmies. Jimmies on the other hand would be interested in how people travel so they can determine – with your friend Glen Clark – where to petition for billboards.
You;d be amazed at how much and how far that info goes.
and actually the statistics do not get down to actual address of a house or apartment. It’s all collected into collection units about the size of a political poll at the federal level, the size that would take you and I (when in decent shape, even though pear is a shape) about a week to do dumping pamphlets.
But to be fair you make some very good consensus out of much of the
current nonsense that makes up the census.
Keep at it Old Boy.
and by the way I was talking to a friend of mine who volunteers alot in the community in Vancouver. Man was she ever pissed about those tickets given away to the Paid People at Silly Hall. She says and I agree that those tickets should have gone out to the real volunteers in the city those who do it because they care about the community and get things done because such things need to be done.
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You honestly believe that local govt policy is set by using any of the data as a determining factor? I don’t. I asked two local Mayors over the weekend and they both laughed.
And if businesses want marketing screens–PAY FOR THEM. We shouldn’t have to drop our shorts because some corporation, big or small, won’t pay for their marketing.
C’mon Seymour…I’m seeing only forest here.
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C’mon Seymour…I’m seeing only forest here.
Douglas Fir, White Pine or Cedar?
Most of the questions on that long form don’t make much sense for
real statistical purposes.
Makes the pencil pouch crowd look busy.
Keep at it there Old Boy.
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Always been a Pine kinda guy myself. When you hit with it, um, er, the ball flies farther…whew!
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So we can both say we both got wood.
(sorry it just came out)
(augh, did it again, awww geez)..
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Oh Geezus…
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So many nowadays have been conditioned to think government is about “services” and “programs” that of course cost more and more all the time, while taking over more and more control of people’s lives.
The sheer volume of the shrieks about this associated bit of nanny state nosiness known as the long form has been most disconcerting, to be frank. The collectivists are winning. This decision by Harper and Co. is commendable, but, like their government, ultimately little more than a speed bump on the highway to totalitarianism.
The brain-washing (in many cases, a light rinse suffices) has been so very effective.
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“Brain-washing”–YES! Perfect analogy!
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Have to agree with you Alex.
A wild one I heard was someone quoting an official at the TD Bank who said he was against the decision as they get a lot of important data from the Census.
The last thing we need is giving the banks something for free on the backs of the taxpayer. If they want this data so badly PAY FOR IT YOURSELF. As much as we all want to see healthy banks to keep the economy going we have to draw the line at free handouts like this.
It might actually make sense to go to all these groups who are sniveling about losing the long form data and telling them if they want to continue it the way it is they will have to help pay for it up front before it is held. Me thinks once this is proposed all these freeloaders will change their tune.
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Sure, I agree with you. There is just too much freeloading going on and it makes zero sense to me. Businesses, banks, corporations…we are we giving up any part of our liberty to save their marketing budget? Makes no sense at all.
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I have, when I was a starving student, twice had the displeasure of being one the thousands of “Trained Professional” census enumerators. Going door-to-door begging and coercing people to fill out their forms — harassing them with phone calls when they don’t send them in — actually reading their forms to make sure they filled them out properly. I did it all — for a couple of hundred bucks. I’ve heard people smarter than I say that the census is too expensive and ineffective. A better, cheaper alternative could be to simply do a random sampling. Some experts suggest that we would get more accurate results than the door-to-door headcount. Let the howls of derision be unleashed upon me for my heresy.
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Very well put.
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I’m really amazed and suspicious about the wave of “popular support” we’re seeing in CBC Online Forums and polls for people actually supporting the long form and lambasting the government for scrapping it. I think many Liberal bureaucrats are spiking these results as a contrary reason to do so, and because we all know bureaucrats love statistics. The long form is really intrusive, and we really don’t get a good “view” with only 20% of Canadians filling the thing out. Why don’t they get the information on Canadian habits from Facebook? 100 years ago simple questions were quite enough to get a statistical look at Canadians – why must they know who does the most housework in your household, or who spends the most time on the toilet?
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Because for years, they’ve had the easy way out. The govt in the great liberal nanny-state must provide all. It’s ridiculous.
You make excellent points.
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Hi Alex, You stated above: “are we giving up any part of our liberty to save their marketing budget? Makes no sense at all”.
I wonder how many of these “opponents” of the change, did give up their defence of invasion of privacy, usually taken to absurd extremes.
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